Welcome to Vintage Tea! A new feature on my blog! I was so honored when Kara Loewentheil of UnF*ck Your Brain agreed to be my very first interviewee! First of all, I struggle with asking people for... well, asking for anything. But I could almost hear Kara's warm, personable, and wise podcast persona coaching me to "feel the fear and do it anyway."* So I gathered up my courage and asked her before I had quite even formulated what it was I wanted to do with this feature! I did explain to Kara that I had worked on a similar Take Five feature with poet Cynthia Manick while I was an editor at Easy Street Magazine. I love an easygoing interview format! It's a fun way to be introduced to someone's work and inspiration.
Every other week, I'll be metaphorically sitting down to tea with one of the incredible women whose work inspires me to seek out and find my own passion. If, like me, you're in an in-between moment of your life– in my case, my daughter just started kindergarten and my son is still at home with me while I try to start working again – I hope you'll draw as much inspiration from incredible, passionate, smart, funny women like Kara as I have! However, if you've listened to UnF*ck Your Brain, Kara's always brilliant and often hilarious podcast, you'll also understand why it proved so hard to limit myself to only five questions with her, gah!! Luckily for me I started this series off with a coach, because Kara was incredibly patient as I blundered through the process. Hopefully, I will be a little more on point next time, but here are my very first five questions in all their meandering glory! And again, I'm so grateful for social media and the opportunity to connect with women like Kara, because expanding my blog has been a dream for a while, but I don't know if I would have had the courage to ask someone else first. Is there anything in your life that you're dreaming of doing but afraid to try? Is there a first step you could take towards your dream? Read on for more courage and inspiration from this beautiful lady.
*Feel the Fear and Do It Anyway by Dr. Susan Jeffers
1. You have such an impressive resume! Could you describe your background a little for new readers or listeners? Do you think it was all of your varied work together that inspired this podcast, already described by many listeners (including myself) as “life-changing”, or was there one specific event or moment in your life that inspired you to pursue this work? On a related note, what’s your inspiration for your weekly podcasts? Do your ideas come from listeners or from your own work and observations?
I started my career as a lawyer – I attended Yale College and Harvard Law School and was a reproductive rights litigator and then an academic working on women’s legal rights before I became a coach. I absolutely think that background has informed my coaching and my work. I see a lot of life coaching and self-development stuff out there that at best ignores social justice and structural issues and at worst is actively appropriative. And then there’s a lot of feminist social justice discourse that is depressing and alienating. What I didn’t see anyone offering was what I have created: An empowering individually-applicable body of work and set of tools that takes social structures into account but actually teaches women how to change the self-defeating thoughts that patriarchy teaches them to think.
Podcast-wise, it’s both. I do quite a few listeners question and answer podcasts where I answer individual questions, and I create new episodes with new content based on what I’ve learned in my coaching work, my reading, my conversations with my clients, and my own self-work.
2. Can you talk about your work environment? I’m fascinated by the relatively new field of podcasting and I bet I’m not alone in that. Do you record at home? I’ve personally done a little voiceover work in studios, most notably for Jay Marks' full-length animated feature, playing Gretchen in a modern-day Faust set in Montreal, and doing the worst French accent, partially because everyone has this preconceived notion of what a French accent is and partially because I am really bad at accents. (To be fair to Jay, an Emmy-winning animator, my father does sound like Lumière in Beauty and the Beast, so there’s some truth to that stereotype.) But I also recorded some stories at home for Every Day Fiction, and I didn’t realize how close I lived to an airport in Brooklyn until then, gah! Do you run into any issues working at home? I personally love hearing your cat’s commentary in the background!
I record my podcast from home much to my poor podcast editor’s chagrin. I live in a one-bedroom in Manhattan (NY). When I first started I remember he asked me if I could record in a different room and I was like “I don’t even have a different room”! I do use a mic and a filter he recommended, but it mostly falls on him to work his magic in the remixing/editing. I don’t really think of myself as a podcaster – I’m a life coach who happens to have a podcast.
3. In addition to lawyers (Kara’s podcast was originally entitled The Lawyer Stress Solution before she changed it to the unforgettable monicker UnF*ck Your Brain) I feel like so many writers could relate to the first episode “One and Done: How to Stop Procrastinating”, which happens not only to be the pod’s very first episode but one of my favorites! I’ll never forget the day, a few years back, I found out I was not alone afflicted in the world as this massively procrastinating writer. That, in fact, most English majors (although I was a Comp Lit major) suffer from this syndrome. As a coach, do your clients tend to include many writers and lawyers? Can you talk a little about your coaching program? It sounds so fascinating! I loved the line in one of your episodes about “the first round of coaching” being about how to “get out of pain, and then the second round of coaching was to get into pleasure, joy, and excitement. The first round took away the suffering, but the second round created the next adventure.” I love the idea of approaching life decisions from that place of strength and confidence!
I work with all kinds of women these days although they do tend to be well-educated and professional women. But I find that women of all professions procrastinate. It’s less about the profession and more about the mindset. We procrastinate because we fear the thoughts and feelings we’re going to have when we work on or finish a project – and that can happen whether you’re writing a novel, researching a brief, or charting for a patient.
My coaching program focuses on the thought patterns that create insecurity, self-doubt, people-pleasing, and validation seeking. I teach women how to recognize and identify the thoughts that internalized socialization has created in their brains – women are taught to always worry about what other people think, to seek validation from others (especially men), to worry more about how they look than what they achieve, etc. All of those messages get turned into literal thoughts in your brain that you don’t even recognize. I teach women how to recognize those thoughts and then how to change them on purpose. You can’t create confidence with external achievements – it never works. You have to create it by changing your thoughts from within. I focus on really concrete cognitive methodologies – I’m not really a woo-woo type of coach.
4. Speaking of striking phrases from your podcasts that have stuck in my head, I also loved the phrase “analysis paralysis” from an interview with one of your clients. Although your client wasn’t specifically referencing therapy, how does your coaching differ from therapy? Or, do you consider your coaching similar to therapy? For example, on a related note, I recently watched the new Netflix documentary Feminists: What Were They Thinking? Have you seen it? I thought it was so good! I’d never heard of Phyllis Chesler before the documentary, and I’ve only just bought her book Women and Madness about the ways in which sexism continue to underlie the practice and the art of therapy, so I can’t speak to that but was wondering if you could or had thoughts about that? I know that for me, that’s one reason I was so drawn to your podcast! It feels so fresh, relevant, helpful, and different from what I experienced in therapy. I don’t know if you’ve read her book, but I would love to hear your thoughts on therapy (which I do think can be very helpful for some folks but wasn’t in my case for reasons I won’t go into here)!
I think that therapy tends to (1) focus on the past, (2) focus on the family of origin, and (3) focus on insight with the premise that insight on its own will be transformative. Coaching is different because we focus on the present and the future, not the past. I don’t believe that your family of origin creates your life or your potential. Occasionally it’s helpful to see where some of your thought patterns originated, but insight alone will not produce transformation. That’s the biggest difference I see. I went to years of therapy and had plenty of insight but I couldn’t seem to change my behavior. The insight on its own didn’t change my behavior because it didn’t change my existing thoughts and actions. Coaching is what teaches you the tools to actually change your thoughts – transformation requires application, and that’s what coaching offers. Most people are already too past-oriented – they think their past predicts their future. The last thing they need is more time thinking about their past. I teach my clients how to be future-focused and how to create new thought patterns that will change their future reality and make it different from the past.
5. While we’re on the topic of books (one of my favorites as anyone knows who follows this blog) what five books would you recommend to anyone looking to change their life and take control of their thoughts? Or just five great reads? Either one! Up to you!
1.Self-Coaching 101 by Brooke Castillo – my teacher’s first book and the book that introduced me to coaching.
2.Essentialism by Greg McKeown – a book all about the importance of simplifying and focusing on the true essentials in your life.
3.Mindset by Carol Dweck – so many of my clients have a “fixed” mindset where they believe their intelligence and skills are limited and innate and they are terrified of failure and rejection. This book teaches you the concept of a growth mindset – if you combine that with thought work to actually shift your thoughts, that will change everything.
4.The Slight Edge by Jeff Olson – a book about the value of small compound actions over time.
5.Killing Sacred Cows by Garrett B. Gunderson – I’m currently reading this so a bit biased but it’s all about a different way to think about creating value and wealth.
Thank you so much for your time, Kara!
Have you listened to UnF*ck Your Brain yet? It's one of my favorite podcasts of 2018 (all time)! It's truly life-changing magic. Read more about UnF*ck Your Brain here. Or check it out here or at iHeart radio or anywhere you download podcasts.
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